what are the civilized/polite world? where is the line drawn between the civilized and uncivilized? -lostindarkness(lostpeople) @硅谷华人论坛:硅谷枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of San Jose

枫下佳缘 / 快乐单身 / To Mr. fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼): I have just finished reading your post, and thank you very much for sharing with me your opinion in an straightforward manner, -asker(asker); 2005-12-30 {288} (#2689431@0)
even though I will not apologize for my English and writing English at Rolia, and will continue to enjoy my freedom of speech as much as you enjoy yours.

Wish you a happy New Year and a wonderful future in terms of relationship exploration and family life.

Sincerely yours,

Asker

"a straightforward manner" -asker(asker); 2005-12-30 (#2689452@0)
说话太古板单调 -tap-tap(开闸灌水); 2005-12-30 (#2689465@0)
Asker,你看你这篇帖子的语法问题 -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 {703} (#2689644@0)
I have just finished reading your post, [这里应该用个句号,因为下一句话和
这句话不具有并列的关系] and thank you very much for sharing with me your
opinion in an straightforward manner,[1. 这句话没有主语,读起来就很怪2. share
something with somebody, 而说成share with somebody something就很别扭. 3.
应该用句号. 4. straightforward更多的是指浅显易懂的意思,显然你想说我很直率
5. 用way比用manner好] even though I will not apologize for my English and
writing English at Rolia, and will continue to enjoy my freedom of speech
as much as you enjoy yours.[1. even though这里应该成But 2. speech应该用speaking. 3 and后少了I]

哎, 你的英文实在是.....

跟那个老外学的? 感觉是你先学了口语才学了书面语

我倒觉得她是先学了书面再学的口语，句式活象国内的官方翻译 -seinfeld(illusion); 2005-12-31 (#2689658@0)

You have perfect understanding of the difference between spoken English and written English. You are right that most of my posts are written English, and I still have difficulty with English slangs. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {63} (#2689726@0)
But I learnt spoken English a bit earlier than written English.

you are so funny buddy. I agree with none of your comments. -sunding(sundin); 2005-12-31 (#2689668@0)

You. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2689669@0)
Thank you. :) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689715@0)

Thanks for your reply, even though I DO NOT agree with you on this point. My English is not the trigger that offends you, is it? You may need something else to help you contain your temper. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {41} (#2689717@0)
Wish you have a good mood and happy life.

这是我在ROLIA主页上发现的“其宗旨是帮助中国移民在加拿大更好地发展”。 -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 {280} (#2689740@0)
我想来这的大概都是中国人把，如果是能用中文是最好了。如果不能用中文(因为某些原因)我觉得也无可厚非。英文好坏都是次要。只要能沟通就行了，何必在意英文的好坏呢，不清楚说什么，你可以说他胡说八道，也可以问到底他是要说什么。他出招，你就拆招，我想这难不到你把。如果你不愿拆，你就走而远之。

First, if Rolia is a Chinese-Only BBS, I would not write here, because my Chinese pin yin is terrible, my Chinese typing is extremely slow, and I only have the NJstar Chinese processor. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {99} (#2689787@0)
But Rolia is a BBS in both Chinese and English, so I think I could write English as well as others.

you are very conscious of self-defending -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 {1072} (#2689963@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I am not sure how much chinese you know. What I was trying to say in my comment regarding to Mr. FullMoonnight comment is that you have freedom to say what you want to say in the style you like here.

Since this site is mainly for new immigrants from china. I would assume that people coming here are mostly chinese, and I would also assume that they would like to see (expect)chinese here. Otherwise, the hosts will make it in english, not chinese on its main page.

I am not critcizing how good or bad of your english is because I do not think I am in a position to criticize anybody since my english is not that good neither. In my statement, I did indicate that for some reasons that some people can not type chinese, so, they prefre to use english, and it is perfectly understandable. I have had such experiences too.

Please do not make comments before you fully understand what you are going to comment on, this is really bad at work, or life. and If you are chinese, I would suggest you to learn some chinese before you make next comment on chinese.更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

I have no intention to defend myself. The mistakes that I have made in spelling and grammar are out there, and everyone can see. Why should I hide them? -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {277} (#2689972@0)
My point is that if you cannot convince me with reasonable professional knowledge,
I will not accept whatever you say, even though I appreciate it.

Do you think Mr. Fullmoonnight's attitude is polite, objective and civilized? Do you think we Chinese should learn from him?
Don't you think defending yourself on a Chinese BBS is a waste of time? I think defending yourself and discussing with others are two different definitions. I think I am discussing with others. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689976@0)
Could you please tell me what you think of Mr. Fullmoonnight's attitude? -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689981@0)

You seem lost your track,or do not know what you are saying here -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 {637} (#2690024@0)
I remember that you said you have freedom to say whatever you want to say, so do others. You also said you do not care about what others think of you. why you now care about Mr. Fullmoonnight comments on you so much. can you just forget about it and do whatever you like as usual? If you think some Mr. Fullmoonnight's comments are good, then, take them and you can improve yourself. If not good, then, just forget it, how difficult is that? Do you need to fight back every time?

to my impression, you can not affoard to lose. can you just simply forget it?

anger will make people unhappy and looking older, remember that.

I do not care about what others think of me including Mr. Fullmoonnight, but I also said that I do care about if people respect each other. Haven't you read the second sentence that I have written? -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690033@0)
You can write Chinese if you like. I can understand Chinese perfectly. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690038@0)
In other words, Mr. Fullmoonnight has the freedom of speech and the right to degrade himself by using impolite and rude words, but he does not have the rigtht to degrade others including me. Got the point? -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690045@0)

You sound a little "silly" -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 {817} (#2690083@0)
people can not be degraded by others, only by themselves. If you do not do anything against humanity, people will not look down on you. Agagin, you care about others thinking about you (I think we all do), and you like the good ones, not the bad ones. Remember, whatever Mr. Fullmoonnight says about you is his opinion, and sure as you said, he has freedom and right to express his opinions. Maybe your behaviours here are not suitable for him and that made he make the comments. He is not representative of all other people. From posts here, I can see there are some supporters of yours. So, whatever he says does not degrade you. If you keep arguing with him/her, you will make yourself look bad. Let's put an end to it. As you said, life is short and busy, let's get on with our lives. Don't you agree?

"People can not be degraded by others, only by themselves." This is a great point, thanks. My point is that we may need to try to make the world more polite by telling others that we deserve respect. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {152} (#2690105@0)
If we don't care about others' attitude, what will the world be? That might be why we need law and regulations to maintain our order and civilization.

We do not tell/ask/force others to respect us, we have to earn it by doing something we call good. After that, it is up to others if they want to repect us or not. -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 (#2690348@0)

If you don't tell others that they are rude, they may think they are doing the right thing. Some people need to be told what respect is and why respect is so important due to their absense of common sense. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690107@0)

Good opint! -bookworm(晕晕); 2005-12-31 (#2690136@0)

Do you think a civilized and polite world is born by itself? I don't think so. That is why we need to define the difference between respect and disrespect. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690115@0)

what are the civilized/polite world? where is the line drawn between the civilized and uncivilized? -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 {1136} (#2690385@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛what is civilized/polite world? it is not coming out from blue. There is an uncivilized/impolite world which coexists with civilized/polite world. It is like this before, now, and will be like this in the future.

again, I am here not telling people what are right or what are wrong. Just state what I think it is right and what I would do in the situation.

My whole point is: if you think others' behaviours are out of your civilized definition, then tell them what they have done wrong based on the civilized definition, and it is up them what to do next, they can choose to live up to your standards or they can choose to continue their own. You do not need to keep pointing or explaining yourself to death. it is just a waste of time and make yourself in to the same circle. It is just to me that we should know when to draw the line. Otherwise, it is going to go on forever until one side is tired or something. Just for example, in the election race, politicians sometimes call each other's names, would you put them in uncivilzed world?

The world is not perfrect, we have to live with it. dont you think so?更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

I totally agree. Good. And your English is very good. Impressive. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2690207@0)

Really? Such as "behaviourS", "chinese"...I should stop here. I don't even know why I am doing this? :-) -bookworm(晕晕); 2005-12-31 (#2690264@0)

He only had a few mis-spellings. Nothing major. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2690268@0)
英语写作,拼写错误扣分很少. 因为可以用Word做检查. 但是语法句法结构的错误会让人得低分的.他的英文很干净,结构清晰,条理很好.一看就是经过专业训练的 -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2690272@0)

Really? Like this "you care about others THINKING ABOUT you (I think we all do), and you like the good ONES, not the bad ONES" ??? -chachacha(茉莉花); 2005-12-31 (#2690278@0)

You are so cute. :-) I wanted to pointed it out too. But just ... You know, my point is that we are learning. -bookworm(晕晕); 2005-12-31 (#2690299@0)
OK,I am chinese, I admit my SPELLING is not good, my GRAMMAR is not good neither. But I do not think it is necessary to check for those as long as I make myself clear here. Don't we all do this on the fly??? -lostindarkness(lostpeople); 2005-12-31 (#2690400@0)

"not .... either". -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2006-1-1 (#2691430@0)
It is Fullmoon who doesn't like reading English here, not me. You can certainly write in English if you'd like to. -chachacha(茉莉花); 2006-1-1 (#2691816@0)

Do not get me wrong. I like good English as your guys wrote. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2006-1-1 (#2691837@0)

Here is an example. It is correct. "It's better that way, when you don't have to care about others thinking about you/". The whole article can be found here. ==> -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2690453@0)

How did you get that example, through Google? It is not a good one to follow, though. The better way to say it is "you care what other people think of you" rather than "care about other people thinking about you." -chachacha(茉莉花); 2006-1-1 (#2691804@0)

Agree. I can see that you have a very solid English background. Why not join us as a English club member. We can learn from each other. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2006-1-1 (#2691817@0)

Like you and I are discussing with each other right now. We do not use impolite and degrading words, but objective and polite expressions to demonstrate our different opinions, which is a civilized manner in my view. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690056@0)
Not bad comments. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2690202@0)

Your English is much better than somebody's. Looks good. -fullmoonnight(圆月夜.老狼); 2005-12-31 (#2690200@0)

Second, I have never said my English is perfect, and I have no intention to show off anything except sharing and exchanging my opinions with others. Why should I need to show off at Rolia, a BBS? -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689791@0)
Third, I don't think all comments of Mr. Fullmoonnight are wrong. I admit that I have made spelling and grammatical mistakes, but I don't fully accept his , because I may trust my own professional English teacher -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {28} (#2689795@0)
more than Mr. Fullmoonnight.

hi, soooo nice to meet you here. Actually my guess is that your english is muuuuuch better -once(chocolate); 2005-12-31 {219} (#2689813@0)
tnan me at least. Whatever other friends say, I strongly support you keep communicating in english. It's fun and easy to express one's feeling in one way or another, am I right?:)
PS:
Mr.fullmoonnight,
no offense

Thanks, I have no intention to compete with anyone else in English though.:) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689817@0)

记得simon说的那句话吗？你的老师有没有找你收钱？如果有，找他/她去refund.:-) -kevin_tor(KFC); 2005-12-31 (#2689880@0)

I will definitely write English the way I have been, and post English at Rolia whenever I am on vacation and have time and energy. Are you going to 吐 again? Go ahead, and have a happy new year. :) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689888@0)
Just a reminder that do not 吐 at KFC. :) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689891@0)

吐啊吐啊就习惯啦,我正在慢慢的习惯您的英语.:-) -kevin_tor(KFC); 2005-12-31 (#2689897@0)

I am sincerely and profoundly touched by your spirit of persistence. Good boy. :) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689919@0)

The end of my conversation with you. Thanks for continuously reading my posts while 吐. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689896@0)

Fourth, I appreciate Mr. Fullmoonnight's honesty in terms of sharing his opinion with me, but I may not accept his attitude. I think respecting others is the basic human courtesy, and Mr. Fullmoonnight -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {41} (#2689803@0)
may need some improvement in this regard.

Mr. Fullmoonnight absolutely has the right to comment on my posts, however, in a more polite and civilized manner. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689810@0)

"however, I would appreciate it more, if he could express himself in a more polite , objective and civilized manner." -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689815@0)

Fifth, does Mr. Fullmoonnight genuinely care about whether I write English or not or whether my English is good or bad? I have no clue, just that if he does have issues other than my English, -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {51} (#2689825@0)
he may need someone else for help. All best wishes.

Just BE YOURSELF, Asker. I believe there are many people support you. I actually made a lot typos and grammar mistakes too. I welcome all critique, and will defend myself if I wasn't wrong. -bookworm(晕晕); 2005-12-31 (#2689948@0)

Thanks. Actually I don't really care about what others think of me in terms of English or other things. Life is busy, and I am pretty much absorbed in my own world. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {69} (#2689949@0)
I just step out of my world a bit to some Chinese BBS on vacation. :)

我终于没忍住，吐拉。 -kevin_tor(KFC); 2005-12-31 (#2689866@0)

如果用英语表达您的意思，我会这么说 -haoxia74(haoxia); 2005-12-31 {1083} (#2689926@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I just read your post. Thank you for sharing your opinion with me in such a straightforward manner. But I am sorry to tell you that I do not want to apologize for my English and the fact that I write in English instead of Chinese on Rolia. I believe I have the right to enjoy my freedom of speech here as much as you enjoy yours. So I will continue to do this on Rolia.

本人认为，finish 在您的句子里非常不必要，有汉语思维的痕迹。至于时态，可以用I have just read your post 或 I just read your post.（是过去时）我更喜欢在这里用后一个。 sharing with me your opinion 或sharing your opinion with me 应该都可以，我更喜欢用后一个。加上such使这个句子读起来顺多了。even though在这里也是汉语思维，用了这个词这个句子显得非常不礼貌。my English和writing English好像不能并列用，my English 是名词，writing English是动名词。on Rolia 还是at Rolia，对不起，我也不知道该用哪个，我觉得似乎用on Rolia好一些，或许都对，或许都不对。有人知道，请告诉我。

本人来加拿大时间不长，英语还在学习阶段。欢迎批评指正。BTW, I personally think you should apologize for your English. I apologize for my English.更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

Thank you very much for your input. Yours is more conversational, meaning yours is spoken English. Different people have different writing styles. :) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689955@0)
I am not a grammar expert, so that I may not be able to provide you with my own comments on your grammar analyses. My suggestion is that learn English by reading academic and formal English books -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 {39} (#2689957@0)
instead of burying yourself in grammar.

Or do not learn English by chatting on line with others. -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689959@0)

I like your attitude. -bookworm(晕晕); 2005-12-31 (#2689962@0)

Yeah, his/her attitude is polite, objective, constructive and civilized. And most well-educated Chinese have this attitude. :) -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2689967@0)

I actually forgot to add " except the last setence". :-). I just don't like that some people tell others what 'should do'. It is more polite to state your reasoning and make a point. And let -bookworm(晕晕); 2005-12-31 {25} (#2690010@0)
others decide what to do.

Absolutely. We may use "my suggestion is..or my opinion is.." to replace "you should.." -asker(asker); 2005-12-31 (#2690019@0)

asker, 真的不敢多读你的english, 好不容易学会的英语都快被误倒成你的 chinglish .....真的..只能用'别扭'来形容你的... 不过, 你的勇气可夹..不是说,学语言就要大胆说写...但最好在本地人面前....OR, 误导咱们新移民了 -redlobster(nuxia); 2005-12-31 (#2690430@0)

A good point. Thanks. I apologize for my wording. -haoxia74(haoxia); 2005-12-31 (#2690676@0)

@San Jose

what are the civilized/polite world? where is the line drawn between the civilized and uncivilized?

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